Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
Thank you so much for your wonderfull answers. Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krsna
Please accept my most humble obeisancess.
vancha -kalpatarubhyas ca
krpa sindhubya eva ca
patitanam pavanebyo
vaisnavebhyo namo namah
Hoping to become your friend and servant,
Ishana Thakura das
Some more replies from Facebook on these questions. So grateful for all the wonderful inputs by the devotees.
Tarun Gambhir
Dear Maharaj, this is not just western thinking but also many Indians think this way that if someone is engaged in spiritual activities and is obeying celibacy and renunciation from material attachments, this is due to his/her failure in achieving so called Material Success or him/her has chosen this way to satisfy false ego. But I believe that if someone has chosen this way for krishna's love then he/she is least bothered about such comments and concentrate more in spreading krishna consciousness activities.
Prema-Rupa Devi Dasi
1. A few have fallen down, this is true, but there are so many exemplary western devotees, and even if there is some fall down there is no loss or diminution on their path to Krishna, they just pick up again in their next life. It is difficult, yes, but not impossible, and Lord Caitanya recognizes that struggle.
2. for millions of lifetimes you are doing the exact same activities, working at some hopeless job and providing for your family. Maharaj has realized how futile this existence is and has given it up. thinking "oh if I dont do this then how will my family survive? oh how will my neighbors survive? what will happen to my country?" This is called a miserly mentality.
Prema-Rupa Devi Dasi
3. Grihasta means Krishna Conscious householder life. Making money and raising a family without devotion is not called grihasta, it is called grihamedi. You can be a householder and still be Krishna Conscious like Bhaktivinoda Thakur.
4. Again, there are many exemplary western devotees who do live a Vedic lifestyle. It is not a matter of Indian or American, Krishna Consciousness can be applied by anyone at any stage of life.
Gadadhara Das
Vaisnava means trancendental self realised soul. It is possible to be fully absorbed in Bhakti in the west. Obviously there is a big difference between external cultures such as Indian and American etc. But one is missing the point. Krsna consciousness is not external. Although it may help to undertake common external ways. i.e certain recommended sadhana practices, which results in realisations.
It is true also that many devotees try to act in certain ways which are not natural, for example a westerner trying to be Indian, or vise versa, leading to imbalance. Spiritual life means to be oneself, this is the challenge.
Some of Prabhupada Bhaktivedanta Swami's disciples have fallen down, and many haven't. There is a mix of many different people with different adikhar, spiritual qualification. There are some idiots, some 'nice' people and some really advanced souls. We cannot see what level someone is on if they are more advanced than us, so we should be humble and respectful.
Gadadhara Das
We should also associate with like minded souls, and deal appropriately and offer respects to those whom are slightly more advanced and those whom are less, this way there is a smooth transition between different levels. Otherwise there will be a kanishta adikhar (lower level), unkowingly offending the higher souls. This is the worst thing possible.
All comments such as you are practising spiritual life simply because you are not materially successful, can be true for certain people. I am not aware who is involved in these cases. But there are certainly many amazing devotees who are sincerely following and are therefore considered perfect. It is very wrong to say they are not doing the right thing.
There are also many devotees who are conditioned to believe that what they are practising is bhakti, when in reality they are also living on the periphery.
Gadadhara Das
It is true if we are born in west we can act accordingly, rather than following someone else's external culture. Again, this is not pure bhakti, vaisnavism.. But what does it mean to live a devotional style life? It doesn't mean wearing certain clothes and practising certain rituals, meant exclusively for Indians. Vaisnavas can be born into any family, country etc.
There are many self realised souls taking birth in the west now. They should follow their own way sincerely. Each individual is so different.
And if we are not sure about some issue, such as where we should live and how, then we should sincerely ask for guidance from Krsna (supersoul) and from advanced vaisnava's (souls). If something doesn't feel right, we should be honest and adjust. Going towards the truth we become more blissful, not more miserable. We need a natural balance within ourselves, both individually and collectively and within the east and west, spiritual and material. All the best!
1. It is not posiable for us westeners to fully absorb vaisnava culture and behaviour. There are too many examples of western born devotees, swamis and gurus that leaved this process. How many disciples of Srila Prabhupada are still here? Dont fool yourself that you can live in India and go to Swami! We are not mentaly and phisicaly fit for such way of living. Your attempts are just poor imitations.
That is not at all true. There may be examples of some who have left the process but they are many many more examples of western-bodied devotees who have made it and very steadily perform devotional service in the Holy Dhaamas in India.
2. You are practicing spiritual life because you are not materially succesful like others. You are only feed your Ego with this!
Material success depends on our past karma whereas Bhakti cannot be attained due to our Karma, but only by Sadhu Sanga or devotional association. That said, a householder devotee should try to be at least moderately successful and responsible in material accomplishments to set an example for others to be attracted to Bhakti. Unfortunately nowadays many people see the material success of a devotee and then become attracted to the spiritual side.
3. Practicing of your "spiritual activities" are just excuses for neglecting your material duties, family etc. Grhasthas must live family life, and you are acting like that you are in renounced way of life. Better earn some money!
Householder devotees have to earn money and also keep some savings for emergencies. But spiritual activities should remain as their main activities since they are svarupa siddha bhakti or those activities which come with our soul life after life.
4. You have some theoretical knowledge but no practical knowledge. For indian born devotees it is natural to live devotional-style life, we are born here (western countries) and should act according to that. Dont try to become what you are not meant to be!
Every soul has an eternal devotional connection to Lord Gaura Krishna irrespective of whether it is embodied in an Indian born body or a Western born body. Thus, it is the natural potential and inclination of all souls to live a devotional life. It is not something artificial or external which has to depend on our bodily conditioning. The quality of Indian culture is rapidly degrading nowadays. But the inherent attraction of the soul to Naama Bhakti Yoga can never be extinguished.
Daaso'smi, BR Sadhu Swami Gaurangapada.
Dear Bruce, Nityananda!! Gauranga!! Hare Krishna!! Jaya Shri Guru Paramparaa! Thank you for the nice question about the divine Sakhaas of Lord Krishna. Here is the answer you seek for:
The sakhas of Lord Krishna in Vraja are of three constitutional types (1) nitya-siddhas, (2) surachara, and (3) sadhana siddhas, which are divided further into four primary types according to their moods: (1) suhrit-sakhaa, (2) sakhaa, (3) priya-sakhaa and (4) priyanarma-sakhaa.
(1) Suhrit-sakhaa
Those whose sakhya is mixed with a scent of vaatsalya, who are slightly older than Lord Krishna, who bear a staff and other weapons and who always protect Lord Krishna from the demons are called suhrit-sakhaas. These include Subhadra, Mandalibhadra, Bhadravardhana, Gobhatta, Yaksha, Indrabhatta, Bhadraanga, Vtrabhadra, Mahaguna, Vijaya and Balabhadra. Of these Mandalibhadra and Balabhadra are the best.
(2) Sakhaa
Those who are slightly younger than Lord Krishna, whose sakhya is mixed with a scent of dasya and who are exclusively attached to the happiness of rendering service to Lord Krishna are called sakhaas. These include Vishaala, Vrishabha, Ojasvi, Devaprastha, Varuthapa, Maranda, Kusumapida, Manibandha and Karandhama. Of these Devaprastha is the best.
(3) Priya-sakhaa
Those who are the same age as Lord Krishna and who take exclusive shelter of the attitude of sakhya are called priya-sakhaas. These
include Shridama, Sudama, Dama, Vasudama, Kinkini, Stoka-krishna, Amshu, Bhadrasena, Vilasi, Pundarika, Vitanka and Kalavinka. They always give pleasure to Lord Krishna by various types of games and by wrestling, stick-fighting and other types of amusement. Of these Shridama is the best.
In his commentary to Bhakti-rasamrita-sindhu (3.3.36�8) Shrila Jiva Goswami has said that although the friends known as Dama, Sudama, Vasudama and Kinkini are known as priya-sakhas, they may also be counted as priyanarma-sakh�s because they personify Lord Krishna's heart and pervade His entire being. In order to establish this he quotes the following verse from the Gautamiya-tantra (15.38):
daama-vasudaama-sudaama-kinkinim
pujayed gandha-pushpakaih
antahkarana-rupaas te
krishnasya parikirtitaah
aatmaabhedena te pujyaa
yathaa krishnas tathaiva te
The purport of this statement is that because Dama, Vasudama, Sudama and Kinkini personify Lord Krishna's heart, they are described to be as worshipable as Lord Krishna Himself. Therefore in the ceremony known as aavarana-pujaa, a particular method of worship described in Hari-bhakti-vilasa (7.360�76) and referred to in the above verse from the Gautam�ya-tantra, these four personalities are offered the first worship with scented flowers and sandalwood.
(4) Priyanarma-sakhaa
The priyanarma-sakh�s are superior in every way to the three other types of sakhaas. They are engaged in extremely confidential services and are possessed of a very special bh�va (sakhi-bhava). In other words they perform confidential services for the preyasis (lovers) of Shri Krishna, they assist Lord Krishna in meeting with the gopi preyasis and they desire to give pleasure to them. These include Subala, Arjuna, Gandharva, Vasanta, Ujjvala and Madhumamgala. Of these Subala and Ujjvala are the best.
The above four types of sakhaa are of three kinds: nitya-siddha, suracara (those who were previously demigods and who attained to the position of Lord Krishna's friends through the performance of saadhana) and sadhana-siddha. Although the suracaras also attained perfection through sadhana, they are classified separately in order to distinguish them from the general sadhana-siddhas.
Daaso'smi, BR Sadhu Swami Gaurangapada.
Nityananda! Gauranga! Hare Krsna!
Dear Ishana... For many years, more than twenty, I dreamed of living overseas as a monk. As a 22 year old man I left my place of birth in a search for meaning. At the age of thirty, and 8 years searching, I chose to take up the practice of Naam Yoga. I found great dissatisfaction with my family upbringing and values. My family taught me as a child that financial world views and owning things was the highest source of happiness. Both my parents come from poor background and worked very hard to raise a family, and that hard work bought much sorrow...
Coming in contact with a cultural movement from India I found purpose and meaning, and a totally different value system. I also found a philosophy which spoke very strongly against materialism... And due to my immaturity I projected that philosophy onto my culture, society, and upbringing. I offended many people. I had become a fanatic...
Sense gratification is simply dangerous because, the soul grosses out on matter, puts blinkers on, and misses out on seeing the bigger picture. The fault did not lie externally, it lied in my projection, it lied in my own ignorance. Spiritual teachers will use examples, words, metaphors etc to awaken the student. But in the end the student must utilize his own intergrity and wisdom... In my opinion, projection is delusion, and to be free of delusion is the beginning of breaking down of illusion. I have chosen to cast aside fanaticism...
My dream to live in India never come true. If I had of went, as an immature man, I would not have had the spiritual depth necessary. The Lord of the heart is so kind in wisdom. I do not know you Ishana, this is my story, which I offer to you in friendship!
I look at Sri Caitanya in my way, my individual life in relation to God. There is only one me and set of circumstances. I hold 'Personalism' as the highest ideal, and 'Diversity' as the key integral quality and essence of all existence. The Lord is in my heart, He is my teacher. External Guru confirms life's purpose...
Here is the way I practice Vaisnavism in my village in Australia. In the small area of town: Yesterday I reflected on Sri Caitanya's words... To be as tolerant as a tree, and as humble as a blade of grass...
I sat under a local tree, stilled my mind, thought of God. I could feel that tree in my soul, that tree is spirit. As I quitened and chanted the Lord's Holy Name the birds came back and played in that tree. The sun shone brightly through the greyish clouds. The tree tolerated my back leaning against its rugged bark, I felt like its bark and energy. Each particle of grass moved in the wind. My prana moved in the wind. My sacred meeting place. I honor this place as a gift from God. I honor this heart space as if it is Gaura Mandala. Where the Holy Name exists is fully spiritual...
Training myself this way, becoming self satisfied and' less empty and aggressive' - maybe oneday I can be of service in Puri Dham. I truly believe Ishana gratitude opens the doorway to love... And finding inner peace, true culture awakens and eyes begin to see everything as a particle ray of Truth. Vaisnavism! I am enchanted and long to see Vrindavan...
Life begins at 40;)... so they say)...
y.s. Neil (Australia).
Dear Devotees,
Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krishna!
I forgot to write this, sorry. One more misconception needs to be addressed. It is not that anyone and everyone born in India takes to devotion like a fish takes to water. Not at all. It is true that there is still a lot of Vedic culture left in India and so those in contact with that culture have a good head start.
But now-a-days things are all changing and the situation here is no different from anywhere else in the world. Here also we have many millions of people with zero spiritual interest. Here also there are people who ask all the questions that are asked in other countries. And considering the number of Mayavada philosophies here, preaching in India is a unique challenge not found anywhere ! 
I am from India and I see what's happening around me.
While there may be a very larger number of devotees in India, let it not give rise to the misconception that only by living in a certain part of the world one can become a pure devotee.
Daaso'smi,
Srinath
Dear devotees,
Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krishna!
People may say our attempts are imitations, but it is they who are all imitating God by trying to be the enjoyer. We are being honest for what we are -- the devotee.
2) People say 'success' what do they mean by that? For them earning thousands of dollars for material enjoyment is success. There were so many devotees who were very opulent and who used their opluence for the Lord alone. We can become a millionaire for the sake of serving the Lord, but not for our sense gratification. Again see positive.
If we ask them , "As if what you are doing is very great..." expect them to say, "Yes it is. I am very proud of it and I know its right. ". But we can also give them the same reply if needed. Devotion ultimately makes us more and more humble, not egoistic.
Success is ultimately a relative term except when used with devotion. Is the richest man in the world the happiest? I doubt. Actually one point has to be made. Whatever we do, we should excel in it to our best so that people are amazed how we can work so hard for the Lord. Swamiji was a gold medalist from IIT, topper in his class -- very few can even hope to get that. It helped his IIT preaching a lot.
3) Yes grihastas earn money and do manage their family duties very well! Everything is spiritual when done for the Lord! So earn nicely and use it all to serve! Yes there are very great grihasta devotees, even on this forum. Hadai Nityananda Dasa prabhu for one. He says that the impersonalistic tendency is to renounce everything and enter into a void to a(void) serving the Lord! Householder life is very ideal for devotional life if done properly.
Yes we stop at a point if our efforts in one service interfere with another service and create a haphazard condition.
Devotee family life is wonderful compared to material family life where people behave like cats and dogs and suffer from so many issues -- just pick up your local family magazines or the newspaper to see.
If you are so serious about the renounced order, then think first if you can handle it. Devotees only renounce when they have another service do to and only when they know they are advanced enough for it.
4) Critics have only some (incomplete) theoretical knowledge and they are all talk, no walk. Not us. We do devotional SERVICE and it is totally practical starting from chanting, etc... Our source of knowledge comes from the Lord Himself so it is perfect -- no need to doubt. Having said that...simply being a theorist is useless. One has to follow and show by example and if we are not spiritually true to our word, then our words have no effect whatsoever on anyone.
There is no room for just advise others in devotion. One has to walk the talk. Even atheistic people respect those who are true to their words. But if I were to cheat, even people who don't follow any devotion will be bound to question us, "You say this and you do that...is that right?"
Ultimately Srimad Bhagavatam says, "No one can be a husband, wife, brother, son, father, mother, friend, or well wisher and especially no one can be a guru if one is not qualified to save them from illusion and bring them to the Lord." And to be a guru, first one needs to have reached the Lord oneself and attained spiritual perfection, or else how can one bring others to the Lord?
This is one point that Swamiji makes very often in his lectures and he is EXTREMELY serious about it. If one occupies the position of the spiritual master without the qualification, then disaster will result. The guru is the most important part of the deliverance process of all the living entities and if that position is misused then it is a spiritual disaster not just for oneself but also for all those other living entities who have placed their faith in such a so called 'guru'. History itself is the evidence for this.
The disciples also have the very important duty that within their heart they must always aspire for a perfect guru who is very dear to the Lord and they must never entertain any desire for any lower standard.
After many painful experiences of my own, one day I realized this and I prayed desperately for the Lord to give me the solution. He did...and I am eternally grateful for that.
Daaso'smi,
Srinath
Dear Ishana prabhu,
Nityananda Gauranga Hare Krishna! My humble pranams!
You are far senior to me spiritually and also in age and so it is not proper for me to do this. But there are many devotees who are questioned with doubts like these in the beginning and for them, I feel I can serve them with this reply. This is addressed to all those who are troubled by doubts like this and whom I feel qualified to serve.
If people try to create doubts in you...this is what you must tell them. This is for the critics.
I will take down one point at a time. First and foremost one thing is certain -- those who do not want to do will always find some excuse not to do. And those who are envious of devotees will always try to stop them from advancing. Neither do they advance nor do they allow others to advance.
Guruji once said in his Srimad Bhagavatam lectures -- People always waste time in negative thinking, "I can't you can't we can't we are not....can't can't can't". Instead of chanting no nos they can spend all that energy and time to chant "Krishna Krishna Gauranga or Nityananda instead"...It is just their own attitude that is their stumbling block -- nothing else.
1) Vaishnava dharma is the religion of the soul and the soul is neither male nor female nor western, Indian, American, European, etc...Any one can become a devotee because all are ultimately devotees of the Lord constitutionally. Nothing in Vaishnava principles is impossible. Is wearing tilaka sooo difficult? Is it so difficult to hold a japa mala? Is it very difficult to say, "Krishna. Gauranga. Nityananda?" Is it so difficult to offer the Lord some flowers? Please....
Yeah right, he fell down, she fell down, ... For Nitaai's sake! Stop! There are so many people who have succeeded ! Right here on the forum there are so many success stories ! Why do you see only those who failed? Have those critics seen those who succeeded? There are devotees who are totally successful. Critics are all Duryodhana -- they could not see one good person everywhere and they just spend all their time gloating how so and so fell down...why should we care for them?
See if I made a mistake I can just move on and everyone will say, "No problem...it's alright." because my position is smalll. But those who are in a big position, if they fall, it becomes a scandal...why? That's why we have to stay small until we know we are capable of serving bigger. So many people fell down...but why? Only the Lord knows what is there in everyone's heart. An examination of people's thoughts will tell the truth. Real devotees never fall. Why don't they see Shrila Prabhupada or some great devotee as their example? When one thinks a low standard is alright, expect disappointment. So enough of stirring hornet's nests.
There are many disciples of Shrila Prabhupada who succeeded...why don't they see them? There are so many glorious disciples. Those who want to doubt can doubt all their life...they don't do anything good for themselves or to others. That's how maya works....those who want faith must learn to rely on the examples of perfect devotees and derive their strength from within themselves.
If people say we can't go to India to be with Swami, that is not a problem. Spiritual association is not bound by time or space. Even computer association is not bound by space One can attain perfection anywhere anytime if one is serious.
Critics can say that we are not mentally or physically fit for devotional life...but they can be fit for drugs, illicit sex, intoxication and they can work like donkeys day and night for better material arrangements. If those critics were working in the army and they were in Iraq or Afghanistan or the Siachen border, then can they say no? Or better, if a mad bulldog was chasing them, all those slowcoaches can become instant Olympic runners.
Lazy lazy! Just another example of can't can't philosophy. The body can always co-operate with the mind. They are not mentally fit because they want to rot!
Ultimately people will devote some time or some energy to devotion only when they feel it is important.
I do not want to be rude but if someone is always trying to pull you down...then sometimes it is good to throw a brick in their direction -- "Enough! Be Quiet!"
I will discuss the other points in next posts.
Daaso'smi,
Srinath
Nityananda! Gauranga! Hare Krishna!
Dandavats and obeissances.
1. Yes many western devotees have fallen down as have indian devotees. These fallen devotees are better than those who have never undergone devotional service because the fallen devotees will get another chance in a future life if they haven't committed serious vaisnava aparadha of course. Those who have never uttered the names of the Lord will likely get animlal bodies in their next life.
So who is smarter, the person who gets a nice spiritual or human body in their next life or he who goes to the abode of Yamaraja and then gets the body of an ignorant animal or tree in his next life? Even if one does imitate devotees but still chants the names with no realizaton, he is still better than the non devotee.
It is not entirely correct to say that western devotees are less fit than indian devotees. All souls are eternally servants of the Lord, the worm in stool and the brahmana in India. Some are more covered by the gunas than others. It is the intelligent duty of each and every soul to start the path of devotional service immediately and reawaken their spiritual propensities.
2. It is mercy from the Lord when one can sincerely approach the Lord. When one is materially opulent this is much harder than when one has less. It is more intelligent to try to advance spiritually than to advance materially. It is actually the natural desire of the self to engage in spiritual devotional service whereas it is foreign to the soul to engage in material activities. This is why material activities always leave one anxious and unsatisfied. Material activities are temporary whereas spiritual activities eternally benefit the self so an intelligent person doesn't overendeavor to be materially succesful because it will all be finished at death.
If one does wants to become materially succesful then worshiping the Lord in that mood will get one more opulent than by one's own endeavors. A person is destined to only be so opulent in his lifetime but with the Lord he has a chance of becoming much more opulent than by his own endeavors.
3. In Grhastha life one must tend to his material duties with detachment but one cannot neglect these duties. One should center their home life around the worship of the Lord at all times in this way home life is tolerable and joyful and not anxiety filled. Material duties should become spiritual by the touch of devotional service.
4. Indian devotees are in most cases in a better situation because they are closer to the holy abodes. We western devotees should try our best to spiritualize our surroundings by the obvious methods. It is much better to advance a little than to not advance at all and become animals.
Our desire should be to move to the holy abodes when possible or take birth there in our next life and this we can cultivate from anywhere in the world.
It may be easier in some cases to worship the Lord with the highest mode of worship which is seperation when one is "away" from the Lord and his abodes.
These people who presented you with these arguments are not very intelligent at all and I think you should let them know this. If they cant accept the fact that what you are doing is infinitely superior to what they are doing, then you should completely ignore them and realize that they are just unfortunate ignorant fools who are as insignificant as a worm in stool.
These are just some of my unorganized thoughts
Sincerely
Jagannatha Gauranga dasa
Dear Gurudeva,
Nityananda! Gauranga! Hare Krsna! All glories to Srilla Prabhupada and Swami Gaurangapada!
I have a three question. It concerns Krsna and his dealings with the cowherd boys in Krsna lila.
In Srila Prabhupada's Krsna Book, in the thirteenth chapter after Krsna has killed Aghasura, the cowherd boys take lunch and "each boy began to manifest different kinds of relations with Krsna, and they enjoyed each other's company with joking words."
I was under the impression that their transcendental relationship was Friendship, so what were the different kinds of relations manifested? and are there different subcategories within the relation of Friendship? Are all the cowherd boys in the same mood of friendship?
Always,
bruce
